Worcester MIGLIA
 

Hi all, been reading most of your build diaries for the past seven months and have been inspired to BUILD A CAR. I currently have two classic cars but I now have the bug to build one, and have selected the MIGLIA.

[QUOTE=Carib Classics;62047]Hi all, been reading most of your build diaries for the past seven months and have been inspired to BUILD A CAR. I currently have two classic cars but I now have the bug to build one, and have selected the MIGLIA.

Carib Classics - Welcome to the forum.

It will be nice to see another Miglia build on here.

Good luck, Paul. :)

Hi carib, welcome, and good luck!

worcester miglia
 

I will try and keep a diary as I am going to need much help from you guys who have built a number of cars. I will be very honest my keenness is far greater than my car building knowledge.
I have a teaching and lecturing background so I do a lot of planning after which I came up with this as my starting point.
September 2014
I decided to use the spitfire chassis, my research found they were far more sturdy and there a more readily available in good condition. What my research didn't show me was that they are shorter in length. Now anyone who knows about cars would have spotted that one car is a two seater and the other is a four seater. Not me.
And so with the purchase of two chassis the build started. Why two? because my project chassis was solid. It had been already stripped, cleaned and painted and was sold as a bare boned unit, [ATTACH]Attachment 1782[/ATTACH]
That meant I had to get another chassis with running gear.[ATTACH][ATTACH]Attachment 1780[/ATTACH][/ATTACH]
Once I stripped the chassis it was discarded for scrap

Have you spoken to Mike @ Miglia yet?

He did modify an original Herald based Speedster to work with the Spitfire chassis for Marc F.

http://i1374.photobucket.com/albums/...psc46e6fa4.jpg

I think the original plan was to offer a Spitfire based version, but it is worth checking.

It would certainly make your life easier compared to buying the Herald based model and them modifying it to fit.

Good luck, Paul. :)

Whoo Hoo a new Miglia builder! I was starting to feel a bit lonely in here :)


You'll fit right in then :)

Best of luck with the project and i look forward to seeing how it progresses :)

w/miglia
 

hi you wont regret it good fun my miglia is on show at a citroen main dealer showroom so nice and warm for the winter now building a citroen 2cv specia rattlerl

Thanks guys for all the positives.
Yes I have spoken to Mike at Miglia , thanks Paul, and he is setting me up with a subframe and body to suit my spitfire chassis.

So that was back in September and much progress since then. My rolling gear came off with very little trouble. I must confess that I am fortunate to be part of a group of enthusiast who think they know everything there is to know about classic cars.
The ring leader is Big Kevin who owns the local garage and is a one of the best fabricator I've ever seen.
He CAN reproduce any shape and size steel panel.
However none of this mad group have ever built a kit car so I'm venturing into territories green for us all.
The great thing about the group is that everyone chips in to help whenever there is something to resolve. Out of hours we have full access to the ramps and extensive snap on tools that belong to Kevin and Chris who work at KW Auto and classics Cars Bromsgrove Worcestershire full time. Although I have my build in a lockup, once the basic rolling chassis is built, and I can get some space? its round to the garage for advice and verbal abuse.

October 15th 2014
 

With my two chassis in two different locations, I could get busy. Everything was removed the suspension donating chassis it was all power washed, dried and the long task of cleaning and painting began.Attachment 1785Attachment 1786

October Cleaning
 

My build chassis was secured in my lockup, which is where all my main bits will be stored as I obtain them.Attachment 1787 Attachment 1788.
Did someone say whats that under the heavily wrapped polythene sheets? Well thats my 2litre Redtop race prepared engine. I will back a ford type 9 five speed box or a T5 gearbox to it, and as they say, thats all she wrote. YES VERY NICE!!!!
Oh can anyone say whether the standard prop and diff will cope with that monster setup? All those who have build a V8 version, what did you do with your back end?

October and My Life with the workshop bench Vice
 

With all the garage equipment and tools at my disposal, my two large bins of suspension parts were stored at KW Auto. The cleaning of the suspension parts?guys they takes a lot of time, particularly under the eyes of Big Kevin, he is a stickler for detail. All my spare days and evenings were spent with a bench vice. To be honest, it made the final striping and cleaning so much easier. Everything is washed in clutch and brake cleaning fluid,Attachment 1790
then given a thorough wire brushing to remove all the rust
Attachment 1791
before it is either hand painted for the chassis engine mountsAttachment 1789
or sprayed the appropriate colour as part of the suspension unit.
Attachment 1792Attachment 1793.

October lots of clean bits
 

Nice clean Suspension Bits
Attachment 1794
Attachment 1795
Attachment 1796
Attachment 1797.

October lots of clean bits 2
 

More Nice Clean Bits
Attachment 1798
Attachment 1799
Attachment 1800
Attachment 1801.

November and Location Switch to the Lockup
 

With October ending there was still a few parts still to be cleaned and sprayed, and so November arrived and I was still married to the bench vice. However it all ended and all my clean bits of suspension and accessories were transferred to be stored and hung in the lockup.
Attachment 1803.
The lockup was also where I was going to do my basic rolling chassis build, but before I could start my build I had to prepare my build chassis in the same way I had addressed the suspension.
So with an electric generator borrowed from Kevin for the tools and light which I had erected, my cleaning and striping began.
Attachment 1804
Attachment 1805
I used a flat electric metal sanding disk on the flat areas, to strip it back to the bare metal looking for any holes and a series of wire brushes in the small and tricky areas.
Attachment 1806
The area is cleaned with brake and clutch fluid to remove any grease and dirt before a thick hand brushed layer of silver metallic paint was applied.
Attachment 1807.

nice work, you have most of the easy stuff done!

stonking engine to go in there - buy a couple of spare diffs, at the very least some from the 6 cyl GT6. just change them each time they break!

you can also get quaife internals. You could also loose the swing arms and go full independant with cv jointed rear that will unload (laterally) the diff so allowing other diffs to be engineered in (subaru, nissan).

Say hi to mike for me!

Nice work CC you are well on the way, you mention fitting a type 9 gearbox thats what i have done but used a GT6 engine, did consider a bigger engine but then there was the uprated brakes etc to consider so stuck with a GT6 for now. There is some good sites on subaru diff conversion in triumph chassis plus uprated independent rear suspension.

Good luck and i look forward to following your progress.

Cheers Swifty

Wow, with that red top and a Spit Chassis, if you keep the build lightweight you'll have close to 400bhp/tonne to play with.

These three (all on Vitesse Chassis and running Triumph six pots) have between 150 and 240bhp/tonne and all are pretty rapid.

http://i1301.photobucket.com/albums/...ps29222155.jpg

Yours is going to be bonkers! I like it.

Mister Towed
 

Nice cars MT, yes I don't intend to do anything to increase the weight. The type 9 gearbox will add a few ponds but thats it. Did you leave your back end as standard?
My intensions are to keep my first attempt as standard as possible with general upgrades such as vented replacement discs, which I have to change anyway. This route will ensure I get the build completed, then go back and either do another build or gradually make the uprated changes.
The guys at the garage think I should do all the uprated and changes this time around, but as its my first lit build, and no-one else at the garage has ever built a kit car, I intend to keep focussed and have it completed for summer or certainly within 12 months.Attachment 1827.
These are a few of the Bromsgrove garage crew. You can obviously tell who is big Kevin. (blonde mop?)The other two are Nathan who's stag had just won best classic on show that day, and Roger the dodger, he can spray anything.

After much trial and error I have now removed the top four leaves from the rear spring (Vitesse donor), and fitted 150lb Spitfire springs to the front, cut down by 1.5 coils, with new, standard dampers all round.

This gave it a suitable ride height with no lowering block needed and great ride and handling as the tyres now stay on the road instead of hopping about all over the place, which they did with stiffer springs fitted.

http://i1301.photobucket.com/albums/...ps42ad1308.jpg

http://i1301.photobucket.com/albums/...psfe20db4f.jpg

As for the brakes, I've got standard drums at the back with grooved, solid discs up front and an aftermarket servo for better feel.

http://i1301.photobucket.com/albums/...ps0e498815.jpg

http://i1301.photobucket.com/albums/...ps71077134.jpg

Bearing in mind I have a cast-iron six pot up front, that setup is plenty powerful enough for fast road use. Can't comment on track use as I don't do track days, but Phil J (green Spyder No.2 above) is competitive with early 911's on the track and has standard Vitesse brakes and about 130bhp from his 2.5 six.

Not sure how much modification the Spitfire running gear will need, but I wouldn't think it will take much fettling to make it a mighty fast car.

Good luck. :)

Keeping power between the tyres and the road
 

Wonderful MT, just what I needed to know much appreciated, I will be putting your findings within my build starting with the back end.I already had a remote servo on my shopping list.
As for the front end, didn't think it would have been a problem, but with my engine potentially being lighter than your six pot, I will certainly start with the reduced height springs.
I've just purchased some 15" wire wheels, are they what you used in your build? One of my major concerns is that the wheel arches are filled. I hate to see kits with undersize wheels, it spoils them for me.

Dec 2nd, Turning and Painting the u/side of Chassis
 

The top of my chassis is de rusted and painted with a thick layer of silver metallic paint and now requires to be turned over so the underside can be addressed.
Attachment 1828.
Attachment 1829.
My intension is to put at least three coats of paint to the underside giving it as much protection as possible. Once again as previous stripping back the existing paint and any signs of rust to be removed and letting the paint do its job.
Happy days, I've found just one hole which I shall get welded once the rolling chassis is in the workshop for the engine and gearbox fitting.
Attachment 1833.
Attachment 1834

Week two in December and the bottom has had its three layers of paint and is now left to dry.
Attachment 1836
Attachment 1837

Christmas is coming and everyone is going shopping, so I may as well join the fun. A set of wheels on ebay, a must have for christmas. Success !!!!!!, I win the set of four 15" Healey wire wheels with tyres. So off I go to collect them with my Buddy Paul. When we get to the seller, we are greeted by a couple of the nicest guys I have ever met since playing with classic cars.
Wayne and Paul at Atkinson Classics in Stoke on trent made us feel like long friends. We could have exchanged stories and ideas about classic cars all day. Plus owner Paul, found two more unused wire wheels with three tyres which he sold me. A brilliant day out. Now its all about stripping, cleaning and buffing them to a polished shine ready for the body fit.

A number of people have mentioned replacing the Trunions, mine seem to be ok, but what do I know.
Attachment 1835.
Can anyone tell me what I should be checking? I intend to replace the end caps, oil seals/rings, thought that would be adequate? The bolts seem to be a good tight fit, but they could also be replaced if necessary. Can anyone educate me?

I have 4.5x14" MGB wheels fitted to mine - they're cheap, easily available and look the part.

The critical thing looks-wise imho is the tyre sidewall height. In this picture my (silver) car is on 70 series tyres and the other two are on 80's (175/70/14 vs 175/80/14).

http://i1301.photobucket.com/albums/...ps51d93a64.jpg

Once I saw that picture I upgraded to the higher profile tyres and raised the suspension about an inch and a half to allow clearance as I felt the other two cars just had more fifties 'presence'.

http://i1301.photobucket.com/albums/...psfd84842c.jpg

That gave me a stance and look that I'm much happier with -

http://i1301.photobucket.com/albums/...ps39890a86.jpg

You'll be fine with 15" wheels so long as you get the tyres and suspension settings right. I use this simple calculator to determine whether tyres will fit and how they'll affect the gearing -

http://www.kouki.co.uk/utilities/vis...ize-calculator

Others may disagree but if I were to fit 15's to my car I'd be going for 155/80/15's which would fit, have similar gearing to the tyres already fitted and give the car an authentic 50's look -

http://www.camskill.co.uk/m53b832s47..._155_15_155R15

Good luck with it. :)

The Worcester build continues
 

Hey guys, YES !!!!! just when you guys thought I'd given up or put the project on hold I'm BACK.
Ok, BIG question????? All inputs are welcomed.
Can anyone confirm AS FACT the actual difference in the wheel base length between the Herald chassis and a Spitfire chassis.
Its decision time for me. Do I build on my existing spitfire chassis or do I need to make changes in order to keep Mikes great body design proportions, on the Herald chassis setup.

Carfolio is a good spot for all those dimensions. Mikes milia is designed for a herald according to his website, so check there. Or you could speak to him and ask.

Tim

I have seen those numbers in the past, possibly in the Haynes manuals?

Failing that, then I'm sure one of the beards over on http://www.club.triumph.org.uk/cgi-bin/forum10/Blah.pl? will know!

Wheel base difference
 

Thanks guys.
I've researched, and it seems to be 8" on one set of data, and 8 1/2" on another.
With that kind of difference it would make considerable difference with the Miglia body proportions if Mike was to make the existing body fit my spitfire chassis.
Has anyone built a Miglia on a spitfire chassis?
Please own up!!!!!!

The build so far
 

Last time I posted I was in the process of cleaning and painting my chassis.
Three layers on the top and four to the underside.
So here we have the final look.

As far as I know Marc F has the only Spitfire based Migia.

There is a photo of it in Post #6 on Page 1 of this thread and a build thread here:

http://www.madabout-kitcars.com/foru...ead.php?t=5384

Hope that helps, Paul. :)

the chassis
 

Attachment 2305

Attachment 2306

Attachment 2307

Attachment 2308

Can anybody help me to find my two shopping trolleys that have gone missing...

Is that galvanised or sprayed silver? I wish I'd had my chassis galvanised...

painted chassis
 

its all hand painted in silver paint. Purchased the paint from Aldi on special discount. Bought three tins, and was able to put three thick brushed coated to the underside and two to the top. I'm very pleased with the final finish.

Missing Trolleys
 

These have worked out great. Where my lockup is located there is a constant supply of baskets being left. once the basket is removed and a spare wheel is put on top of the wooden platform it becomes the perfect working height.
It also make the whole project totally mobile, when you need space on the right it can be pushed very easily. On good days the whole project can be pushed outside. I have found it really easy to work with and i didn't have to look very far for the items.:icon_wink:

Looking at the spit chassis compared to the herald I don't know how you will do the floor? I was originally thinking of an under slung aluminium honeycomb composite, but cost and the difference in the relative heights of the bottom of the herald's main chassis rails and the outriggers changed my mind. However might work for you on the spit.
Tim

Hi CC, I do have the Spit based body in my garage and, IMHO, the proportions work just fine once shortened. For my car , Mike sliced and diced it by 9", and was planning to make a mould but, as that never happened, you will have two choices.

1) Lengthen your chassis - the Corsa Spyder guys do that, so you could probably buy the extensions direct from them

2) Shorten a standard bodyshell yourself (have you got a body, or has Mike definitely got one for you?). A good saw and some careful measurements and you will be done. But it needs a frame to support the sides of the body and crucially the rear radius arms.

Then, on Tim's point, Mike supplied me with floor pans that drop the floor down, but I think I will replace with aluminium. As a guide (and I won't know for sure until I get it up on stands), it looks like I could just plate from the bottom of the chassis across to the side members that my car now has. But if not I will make up aluminium drop boxes as I think they will look good. Haven't sorted what I want to do with seat and seat belt locations yet, but that will come. I will be buying a metal folder to make the task easier.

Edit: Also, you probably won't need the bonnet boxes - Mike cut mine off as part of the conversion. Won't affect your registration as far as I can see.

Yep al floor is what I may do, using mikes floors as templates. I contacted an aluminium toolbox maker with some rough plans for a folded up (origami Ali) floor.
I also did calls in shear and 2mm al should be ok depends on the alloy.
Good luck in your choices
T

2mm Tim? I thought Dave had used 1.2mm, I am loathe to go too heavy a gauge unless I need to. I did also look at honeycomb, but struggled to actually source any, and getting data that made sense to me (as a non engineer) was a nightmare.

But I will continue to ponder and listen to others' words of advice as I don't want my seats pulling out of the floor in an accident. Plating is an option of course, but I am aiming to keep the underside as smooth as possible. But safety is paramount.

Yup, I went for 1.2mm and they do the job lovely.
But remember that I constructed mine with lots of alloy L section on the joins which adds strength as I don't have the space or tools to cut-n-fold alloy sheet to a good enough standard :(

So it was sheets of 1.2mm Alloy, Alloy L section, some 1mm cutting discs, tin-snips and rivets. lots and lots of rivets!


In case it's of any interest here are mine during construction on the one small empty space on my garage floor!

http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f2...ps4c94eb84.jpg

And in place:

http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f2...psd7675b90.jpg


One thing to mention that I've noticed from driving is that if I did it again I would angle the back wall of the foot well boxes so that it slopes up to the cross member as it can be fiddly getting my heels comfortable when getting in and out.