MadaboutKitcars

Gary, have you seen a 1952 Fiat Stanguellini 1100 sport?

Nice.

Not a fan of the Philishave grille though and it could do with lowered floorpans to avoid the 'Noddy' driving position, which, although apparently period authentic in this instance, isn't very pleasant for the driver at speed.

Cool little car , I echo Toweds comments , but nonetheless a pretty little early 50's example ...looks like front of a Cordite and rear of the rare lesser spotted Alpha 1 ..

So what do you do when you find out that the chassis / rear axle you are using as a pattern has a 20mm discrepency that has affected wheel placement in the rear arch ..ie. one wheel would sit inboard 20mm more than the other ... ?

You cut the rear of the body off completely and move it over 10mm !!




We have been chasing a discrepency for ages , couldn't work out why the templates and tape measure were fighting each other ...now remedied !!

The front has not moved as its measuring up accurately ...a bit of extra work in the sill and doorshut area , but worth it in the long run ...

Glan put extra bracing on using 3'' x 2'' lengths of wood to ensure nothing moves ..as she is also starting to get quite heavy ...

Gary,you're probably way ahead of me here, but before you start cutting the body have you checked that both drive shafts are the same length?

If you have a Herald shaft one side and a late Spit shaft the other, that would put one wheel about 30mm further out than the other. If you 'correct' the body for that difference then it won't look right with a chassis with equal length shafts.

CHEERS TOWED ..BUT ITS BEEN CHECKED , DOUBLE CHECKED AND CHECKED AGAIN ...The problem lay with us taking measurements from outriggers that upon closer inspection have been changed ...I have had issues before with this ..should know better really !! All measurements now being taken from main rails etc...
We are within a 2mm difference on the long diagonals at the moment too ..which is pretty good ..

Gary - Good spot and great decision to fix the problem at this stage.

As whilst this is more work for you now, it means less work for the customer later.

Any differences that can be measures in mm is "spot on" in my book.

Good luck, Paul.

A BIT OF AN UPDATE FOR YOU ...

Glan has pretty much gotten the side profile back to where it was before the cut ..we have started to blend the front vent into the body too and lengthen it slightly ..The door has been re-instated and 3mm hardboard spacers in place to gap it ..

We needed to figure out what's happening with the upper cowl and bonnet line , so we put the Z300 bonnet in place to get an idea of where we are going ...



It fits quite well in this pic with it shoved over one way ...the bonnet line and wheel arch are looking quite good .



We need to split the bonnet in the middle , either side of the bulge , reduce its width by a couple of inches , reduce the width of the front wheel humps and radius them a bit more ..more curvy , if you like ... then re-instate the hump , altering its shape slightly ...cut the grille off and upright it , reducing nose length slightly and re-shaping the aperture and flatten the top of the wheel arch opening to take the roundness out of it to match the rears a bit more ( kind of like a '56 500 TR )....so you are looking at a very rough , basic start and not the end product ..but its made me feel good about it , seeing the front in place ...

Coming along quite well. Always more to do...

"We need to split the bonnet in the middle , either side of the bulge , reduce its width by a couple of inches , reduce the width of the front wheel humps and radius them a bit more ..more curvy , if you like ... then re-instate the hump , altering its shape slightly ...cut the grille off and upright it , reducing nose length slightly and re-shaping the aperture and flatten the top of the wheel arch opening to take the roundness out of it to match the rears a bit more ( kind of like a '56 500 TR )....so you are looking at a very rough , basic start and not the end product ..but its made me feel good about it , seeing the front in place ..."

You make it sound so matter of fact Gary
I know how time consuming that list is, my front end has taken many many months and it didn't require half of the tweaks your making.

Its looking good, with the z300 front its got a hint of Tojeiro about it.

It deserves to sell well I think it will be prettier than the spyder.

+1

But, as always, I am looking forward to seeing how you do it.

Will there be enough room for the bonnet to eventually sit over the engine/radiator without the need for a scoop/bulge/opening?

Good luck, Paul.

THANKS ROADSTER ...It is a lot of work , yes , but Glan is a definitely the right man to turn my rambling into reality ...I am so pleased with his work so far ..its absolutely skinting me out ..but the end results will be well worth it ...
Prettier than the Spyder ? Well , equally as pretty , maybe !!! ......I love the S*mmio , for obvious reasons , despite being estranged nowadays ....The Formosa 120 GR ( final name ) will be a different car to the S*mmio range ...same concept , but doors , bootlid , flowcoated bodyshells with minimal bodywork required with exposed tig welded tube internal framework , set back engine etc.... A higher spec , higher priced option ......

PAUL....There may well be yes , not sure what we are doing in the middle yet , but the engines are being set back 8'' , so this goes a long way to sorting clearance issues out anyway ...

Picking up on something you said earlier ...With our cockpit liner , exposed frame , including inner wings and radiator mounts hopefully .. body with minimal prep required ..the task of moving the engine back is greatly offset by the hundreds of hours less involved in body prep and interior work etc....thats the plan anyway ...

Monday I am driving to Southampton to see my mate who I have known for 15 years and we have been involved in projects before ..he runs a business doing custom tubework , Sand Rails , off Road cages etc amongst other stuff including some film work recently ......He is going to be making the internal frames for me as soon as we can get an outer skin body up to him sat on a chassis ....All framework including the rear section with tank mounts and the cowl section for column mount etc. will be tube , even if out of sight ...

Sounds like a good plan to me.

I am sure that if the first builders find everything works "out of the box" it will encourage more sales.

Same thing goes for the framework, which sounds like it will be a big improvement over the Cordite too.

If you can keep the quality high, I am sure this car will do well.

Cheers, Paul.

All sounding and looking very promising Gary.

Mind you, I didn't think there was anything wrong with the original Spyder. When you look at the price to quality ratio they were outstanding value for money - my whole car cost less to complete than any of the current 356 Speedster kit producers charge for just a bare body.

Okay, so the body and frame both needed a bit of fettling to fit, but nothing that was particularly onerous and most of it was due to wanting to modify things rather than needing to.

Oh, and mine passed its fourth MOT this afternoon with no advisories.

Anyway, following this with interest so keep up the good work!

I agree Towed ...Thank you . I am just highlighting the fact that the Formosa 120 GR will be a higher quality kit compared to the cheaper S*mmio offering ...absolutely nothing wrong with the S*mmio ..its just a cheaper option with more work needed ...that suits some builders , especially , like yourself , who have put their own mark on the car , dash etc for instance ...that was the original concept with that car ..The Formosa will still be a flexible build for someone wanting to attach their own identity to the car , but if its a straightforward build the buyer wants , hopefully , we are making it a little easier ...but ease of build will come with a slightly higher price tag .....I feel there is very much still a market for S*mmio bodies as there are lots of enthusiastic wannabee builders with limited budgets ..exactly the situation I was in 7 years ago and why the car was created .....
Although my package will be 3 x the original S*mmio priced offering , it is a complete bodyshell ,complete interior liner and a tig welded tube frame ...so still value for money when compared with other retro offerings on the scene currently ...

At a guess I would say it's this guy and it looks like he knows his way around a bit of tubing ha ha

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/VW-sand-rail-frame-sandrail-type-buggy-tube-frame-COMPLETE-KIT/322291317541?_trksid=p2047675.c100005.m1851&_trkparms=aid%3D222007%26algo%3DSIC.MBE%26ao%3D2%26asc%3D38661%26meid%3D70b888b3a5e64ed5827d9ad412886939%26pid%3D100005%26rk%3D2%26rkt%3D6%26sd%3D262735171143

YEP ..THAT'S HIM ...Mark ...

I spent an hour at his place today and , as luck would have it , he has a Vitesse in the corner ...a few sketches , ideas thrown about etc. and we are good to go ...

Framework is going to be a one piece item incorporating rear frame behind the rear bulkhead that will incorporate the fuel tank mount and bracketry to accept a spare wheel , that will be accessed through the boot aperture...as we travel forward the exposed side rails will locate the body around the doorshuts and be bolted through the chassis using existing bodymount points ( similar to a S*mmio ) , the front section will pick up on the door hinge mounting points and be tied side to side with a tube section running behind the dash including the new steering column mount as well .....The change we have made to my original idea I had was Mark is going to make steel dropped floorpans tied together with a prop tunnel and this will be welded to the framework too.....making handbrake fitting easier too ..

So you will be sat on a steel floor , inside a steel cage.

The only seperate sections are the new tubular inner wings to replace the tin ones and these will have radiator mountings included too ...

So its going to be a very comprehensive frame , that once fitted and the body is fully bolted and bonded to it and the bulkhead in place will become virtually a completely enclosed bodyshell...

Looking very good!

Coming along nicely, good work.

Gary - As always, looking forward to seeing how you will do this.

Will the aero humps be a 'fixed' part of the final body work, or an 'optional extra'?

Despite the shed load of extra work it would involve, I'd love to see a boot that opened like this.



Good luck, Paul.

SOME GOOD PROGRESS MADE TODAY....

Glan has been making templates to check symmetry as he progresses ...

This one was cut to check the door curve as it rolls into the rear cockpit ...



This picture of the template transferred to the other side about halfway through the door mods gives you an idea how much they are being altered ...



Another slice styled template is being used to get the door curvature and top lip matching ....



The final picture today shows the raised lip around the cockpit area ...we were going to offer the headrest as a separate panel but , it was getting complicated trying to make a nice solution to a finished edge around the cockpit with optional headrest and I wasn't happy about it looking too heavy as a separate panel as you need to lay up glass thicker than if the item was made in aluminium or similar , so the flange around the base was going to be too chunky for my liking ..... so its been made a permanent fixture ...the shadow on the picture makes the lip look heavier than it is , its about 5-6mm in reality.. The gap in the lip where it joins the dash area is to accommodate a screen post eventually ...



If we can keep up the pace we are running at so far ....it's hitting me hard in the pocket !! ..we are hoping to start the bonnet on Monday , allowing a couple of weeks for the major changes I want to incorporate ...with a view to getting some of the high build primer on it by the end of January and starting the mould process first week of february or thereabouts ......

Symmetry you say? Tis witchcraft I tell you!

It's massively overrated. .detarrevo ylevassim s'tI.

Lol