This is a read-only archive of the old Madabout Kitcars forum. New posts and replies are no longer possible, but every thread is still here to browse and read.
The 'Panamerica' Aristocat is truly breathtaking. Clearly a lot of thought, time and money has been invested in its creation. Perhaps the owner attended the School for Scoundrels with Ian Carmichael?
... I am not after building an exact copy of a D Type, I would like to lose the fin, for example, and I am of two minds whether it should have humps or not. Either of the two nicest A352s I have seen on this site, the stunning grey and green one with two humps or the Green Classics one without humps would be perfect… if they were 90" in the wheelbase and a little bit wider...
Mick O'Malley wrote:
…IMHO, if you want to drive around in something that looks and sounds like a D Type, and will fool most folk, you can't go far wrong with an A352 on a Spitfire or GT6 chassis frame with a Vitesse/GT6/TR six pot engine. I'm biased, as this is what I'm creating. In over 30 years of playing with kit cars I've yet to see a pedantic nerd with a tape measure dissing anyone's wheelbase or track!…
Hippo - I have some experience of doing things the hard way.
So based on the two quotes above I would strongly suggest going down the A352 route.
You might end up spending a lot of time getting the D Type body shell to fit a suitable chassis.
Then even more time if the chassis alterations mean you have to pass an IVA test.
Whereas this time could be used to create a classic looking interior which will look the part.
In support of Paul's suggestion, I think it is positive to go for something that is reminiscent of a D-type or Lancia D24 etc, etc.. After all, it is never going to be one of these so why pretend? If it looks and sounds the part then you will have something spectacular without the heartache of trying to match things exactly and whether the diff mounting bolts were UNF or UNC........
This is only my opinion.....but an A352 with a six-pot would have heads spinning wherever you went.
Again, I have to agree. If I try to build a D Type replica, I would have to spend a fortune making sure every part is correct and period. Even then, everywhere I go it will be compared and judged with both the unmatchable original and those other superb replicas out there. Not only am I not competent enough to build such a car, I couldn't afford to either.
So. all I would like is a well built generic sixties sportscar which, while it won't be cheap with Jaguar running gear, will be unique. The A352, without question a very pretty car, limits me to a smaller chassis. I am hoping that the D Type body is both longer and wider thereby offering me a wider choice of beefier chassis. So that it can not be confused as a D Type replica, I will be losing the fin (which might be OK at 180 on the Mulsanne Straight but must be a bugger at more sane speeds in a cross wind). I will also lose the central cockpit division. In effect, I will be taking a D Type and making it look like an A352, just bigger.
Those measurements I am looking for, once I get them, will confirm the size of the D Type body and then I will be able to make a reasoned judgement.
Is passing an IVA test really such a drama? Don't almost all new Cobra builds have to go through them, for example? I don't know, I have never had to face one before.
So that it can not be confused as a D Type replica, I will be losing the fin (which might be OK at 180 on the Mulsanne Straight but must be a bugger at more sane speeds in a cross wind). I will also lose the central cockpit division. In effect, I will be taking a D Type and making it look like an A352, just bigger.
Is passing an IVA test really such a drama? Don't almost all new Cobra builds have to go through them, for example? I don't know, I have never had to face one before.
The main problem being that it is yet another barrier to completion. For every finished kit there must be 10 more in garages....
Cobra's are easier because they have been done before loads of times and plenty of internet resources to guide you.
The IVA inspection is expensive at £450 for the initial inspection and then £90 per re test. I know of a 356 Speedster builder who finally got a pass on the sixth attempt so it was effectively a £990 MOT.
The rules around what you can and can't have on the car are also ridiculously strict in many cases.
I accept that they need to check that the seat belts are mounted safely, but are classic Smiths instrument bezels really so dangerous that you can't safely fit them to a car? After all, if my face makes contact with my Spyder's speedo I'll have more to worry about than a cut face
And I'm sure a padded steering wheel will look fine in a fifties Jag replica...
Just reading about Smash new bumpers and noticed the place that made his bumpers also " We have even recreated classic car bodies in alloy such as D type Jaguar from original"
The D type body that I have on the car I am doing has a wheelbase of 90''.
Overall width is approx 66/67'' ( trying to measure on my own ! )
Track appears to be around 57'' , this car has splined adaptors fitted that will add about about an inch or so each side , so the stock SE5 track of 55'' appears to be right .
If I was you , I would forget the Jag Engine because its a huge lump to get into any kit car chassis and I would build a 6 cyl. Vitesse chassie'd car using a stretched A352 body .
The Vitesse is 91'' wheelbase and has a track of 48'' ( if you add adaptors as you will need to , you will be at approx 50''
The stock D type ( remember the Tribute D type is the same as many of them and widened to cater for XJ6 axles ) is 90'' wheelbase and 50'' track width
So , the A352 is probably somewhere handy to a genuine D type width but too short - stretching the wheelbase would give you some fairly close dimensions .
With just the Guide to the IVA Scheme being 65 pages, I wasn't surprised to see the Inspection Manual itself is 299 pages! A few hours spent reading and marking with a highlight pen is in order, I think.
Well, I think we have the dimensions of both the A352 and the D Type bodies sorted, the D Type being 4" wider and with a wheelbase of 90" so thank you all for your assistance, especially Lancelot who went to the trouble of taking physical measurements.
As to the way to go you have all certainly given me food for thought. I shall have to do a little more research, have a bit of a think and then decide. At least I know both kits are available.
Mr Towed, your Spyder, what I can see of it, looks exceptional.
Mr Towed, your Spyder, what I can see of it, looks exceptional.
Thanks Hippo (and Paul), I'm glad you like my car. Nearly three years on the road now and I still love it. I can't claim all the credit though, in case you didn't know, it's an example of a Sammio Spyder developed by Lancelot Link (Gary Janes).
I've found the debate about using the correct engine, dimensions etc. for a D Type rather interesting as I deliberately gave mine a Lancia identity even though it's dimensions are way off. This was the inspiration -
...and this is the reaction it gets at Italian car shows -
Truth is, the original cars are so rare that pretty much nobody notices the difference. So get building yourself a D Type inspired special and don't worry too much about getting the dimensions 100% accurate. Just enjoy the journey.
in case you didn't know, it's an example of a Sammio Spyder developed by Lancelot Link (Gary Janes).
Truth is, the original cars are so rare that pretty much nobody notices the difference. So get building yourself a D Type inspired special and don't worry too much about getting the dimensions 100% accurate. Just enjoy the journey.
I didn't know but I am gradually beginning to realise just 'oo sed an' did wot' round here!
I think you and I are on the same wavelength. I don't want to go to all the trouble of building a car only to elicit, "Ooh, Daddy, look, a Cobra Replica!' (or D Type, or Ferrari, or whatever). Instead, I want people to say, 'Gosh! What kind of car is that?'
Now I know I can provoke that kind of reaction with the 'School for Scoundrels' car suggested as a possible donor car earlier in this thread, but I think you know what I mean.
I don't want to go to all the trouble of building a car only to elicit, "Ooh, Daddy, look, a Cobra Replica!' (or D Type, or Ferrari, or whatever). Instead, I want people to say, 'Gosh! What kind of car is that?'
Interesting.
A very good friend of thirty years built one of the first Westfield Elevens in the early 80s, and we've been to umpteen events together in it ever since. Most frequently asked? "Is it a D Type?". OK, it's BRG and has a hump, but really! Same goes for my dark red Alfa badged Mk1 Marlin Roadster. "Is it a Morgan?" Aaaaaaagh!
The highest compliment, IMHO, that can be paid is to be asked "Is it a real one?" If I'm asked that in my A352 I'll be well pleased!
"Truth is, the original cars are so rare that pretty much nobody notices the difference"
That's a very good point. And the rarer and less well known the car the easier it is to pull off the illusion.
DNA have created a very attractive Ferrari California look-alike, the 2fifty. The original is very rare but quite well known. And, when you open the bonnet of the converted car, it says BMW. So perhaps Chris, with his eye for proportion, might do something similar along the lines of a BMW 507? Very rare, very pretty, and when you open the bonnet of the converted car, the badge on the engine will match the ones on the outside; as well as the ones all over the interior.
So the proportions will not be exactly the same but as you say, who cares? When you pull up at Le Manoir aux Quat' Saisons, the valet will most likely assume it is a very expensive retro chic cabriolet from BMW and park it next to the entrance, rather than round the back with the run-of-the-mill DB's and XK's.
