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I guess it is an age thing. When you started working on cars and the like.
If you take the seat belt issue you raised as a problem coming in in 1972, that is 43 years ago.
43 year is quite a long time to learn and adapt.
They used to make cars out of wood and canvas so you could repair them easily (or because that was the best they had) and when that was replaced with steel you needed new tools and learn techniques to fix the new panels.
I appreciate that you can sand your points to fix the car but saying that you have a car where the points rust up and you have to sand them to get the car working is a better situation that a car that a car that doesn't have the problem seems strange.
Having said that I am sure in 43 years I will be complaining about the nano-tech bodywork that auto restores to the factory settings despite my best efforts to customise it
For what it is worth, I do appreciate simple too. One of my mountain bikes is fully rigid and fixed gear which is as simple as it gets...
...but I also have a full suspension bike with 30 gears for when I want it
I am certainly convinced todays car are much better as 40 years ago,500.000km is'nt rare anymore,cars are saver,more economic,easier to drive,powered steering,powered braking and powered everything.
It tells you how to drive,put on the seatbelt,the doors are closed,the boot is closed,you need service and even if your zipper is closed.
Well.....i am only a little disabled but i can still wind the window up with a cranck,put some pressure to the braking pedal,turn the unpowered steering wheel and i am happy with it.
When i mentioned the points it was just as an example to say how easy such a problem can be solved......and can be repared.
As i found out many times electrical components on todays cars cannot be repared but must be replaced.
Last year my missus Focus drove 20.000km,did'nt brake down but did cost almost 780 euro for only service turns(oil chanche etc.)
The two Anglia's drove also 20.000km,10.000 each.......no breakdown and about 25 euro's each for oil etc.
Oh well,we never be on one line with this discussion,i am just having fun in my old cars and will be driving them with a smile......except when driving the hotrod along the mall..........then i have to look cool
I agree with a lot of what you say, don't worry :-)
I think the cost differences with Oil and Services must be down to you CHOOSING to use a garage for the Focus and doing the others yourself.
When the Anglia's were new, and if you used the local Ford garage, they would have been just as expensive, probably more as they need doing more often.
I would be surprised if your Focus needed more than one service in 20,000KM. In the UK it is Oil and Filters at 12,500 miles (just over 20,000KM). 760Euro seems a LOT, a quick Google shows the UK service cost is approx £235 (324 euro) for a major service and just £129 for an interim.
I do understand about replacing components rather than repairing them but I think people (not just you) overstate the difference.
You might be able to repair a part 5 times every 10,000 miles before having to replace it compare to the modern electronic versions that doesn't break for 70,000 miles and then needs replacing.
I really agree about the bings and bongs of safety warnings though. I cannot put my shopping on the passengers seat in my Merc without being Beeped every 15 seconds to put the seat belt on. Grrr
Still, I managed to disable all that in the Z300 so get the modern pleasure of driving the car instead of fixing it with the old fashioned freedom of warning lights and chimes
The service on the focus included M.O.T.,full service,wipers and some other bits and bobs..........and yes very expansive.
Because the car is still in guarantee period it had to get the service at the dealer(Official Ford dealer)
Official dealerships are always expansive and i always feel ripped off as an independent garage are much cheaper for the same thing.
I agree the Anglia's when new had probably cost the same at service........but now they are not new enymore and i can do the sertvice myself because it is a simple job to do..........no diagnostics or electrickety involved.
If i was sensible i must get rid of these old junk as a modern car is much cheaper to drive,the focus uses 1 litre 18km,the hotrod uses 1 litre every 8km.........but hey,good for the economy and tax.........grrrrr.
I buy cars that were expensive when they were new and smile at the depreciation the previous owner sufferred
I recently sold my CL600 which was £124,000 new including the options.
I paid £12,000 for it with 45,000 miles
I drove it for 5 years with independent servicing as it was out of warranty.
Approx £250 for a service at variable intervals - the computer told me when I needed a service - between 12,000 and 16,000 miles
I sold it for £2000 with 95,000 miles
Reasonably cheap motoring for such a car although the number of buttons, switches, computers and options would probably drive you mad.
Anyway, I am glad we can share our understandings even if we don't agree on the details. If we all agreed on everything the world would be a boring place.
i reckon the real problem was you probably tried the 1.9 engine!
Nope,2.8 six.
The whole driving expirience felt wrong,did'nt like it at all.
Nothing to do with that particular car because it was a good example,all was functional and working fine,good roadhandling,superb brakes.........
Can't help myself.........i am a neanderthal carwise.
Yesterday i drove a brandnew Merc with a lot of letters on the bootlid belongs to my boss.......also did'nt like it.
I felt the same way about the Audi A8 I owned for a while
The most 'adequate' car in the world. i don't mind a few faults in a car if it has some bits that excite me, the Audi was just adequate in everything.
When I make love to a woman I don't car if she feels great or disappointed but I think if she just said "Thanks, that was adequate" I would be upset :-)
A fascinating debate which appeals to me as I have the same dilemma.
A Z3 250swb will cost about the same as a tvr 300Om / Tamar to procure
TVR cheap to run / service, possibly Tax Free, great fun to drive, not many around.
The issue for me is that the Tribute Z3 SWB is new, I like the shape, and I could use it every day, my wife could drive it and there are some modern bits like central locking and air conditioning, ABS etc which make it more practical to own.
Maybe the answer is to buy one of each, still less than the cost of a new focus.
You know that feeling when you wake up and remember that lunch yesterday started with a bottle of red wine and you didn't go back to work......alcohol may have affected my previous postings. Sorry if I upset anyone.
I quite enjoyed your rant, though didn't understand much of it:
WorldClassAccident wrote:
There is a lot of bullshit spread by people comfortable with a spanner but scared of a screwdriver
Sort of got that one unless you were being literal in which case a spade might be better.
WorldClassAccident wrote:
It is like technology racism
no idea about that one
WorldClassAccident wrote:
I do understand where you are coming from but don't bury yourself in some weird past that never really existed.
Lost me there
WorldClassAccident wrote:
Some people post on the internet complaining about modern technology without feeling any sense of irony.
The spanner / screwdriver refers to people who are okay with mechanical stuff but scared of electrical stuff. Electric stuff relies more on screwdrivers than spanners.
Not to sure about the rest although I too like the irony bit
I had thought about the route 'Redratbike' suggested as then you could fit the engine and box of your choice and the dashboard and instruments could be assembled from scratch rather than modifying the original loom.
Emissions are based on the age of the engine so if you can prove the engine is e.g. pre-cat then you don't need one.
or find a seperate type chassis with v5 that is the same as z3 wheel base or closer to the ferrari ?
fit the mounting points for the rear and z3 scuttle windscreen for the doors and roof to line up with ,get chris to mould the longer bonnet if thats the way you have gone then build around that for a more realisitc replica?
nice alfa v6 in rear wheel drive would be good?
I can sympathise with the 'modern cars are too complicated' standpoint, this, my only breakdown in the Spyder to date -
was caused by this -
a modern, multi spark ignition module I'd added for extra reliability, failing under full power.
I've got to say though that changes can be made to the donor that will transform its 'feel' as a car. Tall sidewall tyres, different exhaust, removal of soundproofing etc. My Spyder doesn't feel anything like a Triumph Vitesse to drive now it's wearing its party frock.
I can sympathise with the 'modern cars are too complicated' standpoint, this, my only breakdown in the Spyder to date -
was caused by this -
a modern, multi spark ignition module I'd added for extra reliability, failing under full power.
I've got to say though that changes can be made to the donor that will transform its 'feel' as a car. Tall sidewall tyres, different exhaust, removal of soundproofing etc. My Spyder doesn't feel anything like a Triumph Vitesse to drive now it's wearing its party frock.
Almost RIM compliant more cones and an arrow sign required.
I don't have a problem with nostalgia and preferring old cars to modern ones, a matter of personal choice.
Today's cars are faster, safer, more economical, better braked, more reliable, less polluting, more durable and more comfortable. So yes, an old banger may be more engaging to drive and more fun, just don't try to claim it is better.
I don't have a problem with nostalgia and preferring old cars to modern ones, a matter of personal choice.
Today's cars are faster, safer, more economical, better braked, more reliable, less polluting, more durable and more comfortable. So yes, an old banger may be more engaging to drive and more fun, just don't try to claim it is better.
I take your point about the positive points of modern cars - believe it or not, my 2007 Nissan Micra 1.2 Activ is half a second faster from 0 to 60mph than the original Lotus Cortina (see links below) - but I think maybe you've missed the point about what you want a car to be or do.
If you want quick, safe, economical reliable transportation for a number of passengers and their luggage, you pretty much can't buy a bad car these days. On a budget of £15-20k, anything new from Ford or Vauxhall will fit the bill. Got £30-£80k to spend? You'll probably be happy with anything Audi, BMW or Mercedes can sell you. If money's tight, Dacia do a range of perfectly good cars for under £10k new.
If you want to interact with a car, to enjoy the way it sounds, feels and even smells, I'll be so bold as to say that modern cars, even very, very expensive ones, suffer from an overdose of artificiality, a glut of synthesized sound, faux feel and synthetic smell that fails to replicate the emotions a good classic can instil in you (well, me anyway).
Let's look at a case study, Ferrari.
Given a big enough Euromillions win, I'd have a Ferrari in my car collection.
But it wouldn't be new.
Why would I want a gearbox that changes gear in one nanosecond for me at 190mph, when I could have the everyday pleasure of the mechanical clack-clack of the slim, chrome wand of a classic Ferrari manual gear lever as it slots perfectly from second to third across a polished aluminium gate as I pop to the shops in Town?
Why would I want a race tuned, flat-plane crank engine that sounds like the death wail of an alien warrior at full chat when I can have music from a Colombo V12?
IMHO modern 'supercars' have lost the plot. It's become all about speed. About power. About pub (wine bar?) talk statistics - my car can change gear one nanosecond faster than yours.
Well, I'm boycotting the dealerships of Lamborghini, Ferrari and McLaren until they start building cars with proper manual gearboxes. Cars with real feel to the steering. Cars with soul.
